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14 Answers

Complex Airplane Transition for Private Pilots?

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Flight Instructor, Private Pilot

Hello,

I am new to this site.  I am a fairly new CFI, and have been teaching for about 6 months.  Anyways, I have a gentleman, who is a private pilot with about ~80 hours TT.  He wants to get a complex endorsement, which I will do in our PA28R-200. What would you recommend me to teach the student?  All I have to work with is the Complex checkout quiz my school has.  I understand that the student needs to know constant-speed props and the retractable gear, as well as their operation, system, and failures, but what else do I teach?  I did a rental checkout with him a few weeks ago, and I know he can do stalls, slow flight, etc in a PA28-161 Warrior.  Is this it?  I understand that 14 CFR 61.31(e) requires ground and flight training for the endorsement, AC61-98A does not even have a section for complex transition. 

Keep in mind that for our rental insurance, I need to do 10 hours of time with him in the Arrow and the Checkout Quiz. 

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14 Answers



  1. Wesley Beard on Feb 09, 2011

    I would go throught the commercial PTS requirements for complex aircraft systems and make sure the gentlemen knows that information.  The Pilots Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge and Airplane Flying Handbook as a lot of good information.  I am assuming you know this already but provide it for other readers.
     
    Typically complex airplanes travel faster and also have a faster approach speed.  I’m not sure about the PA28R-200 though, it seemed a little slow to me when I flew it awhile ago.  I would make some short cross country trips during those hours.  It has the added benefit that the student and you both need cross country hours.
     
    During the first cross country leg, you can create a normal scenario where everything works out like it should, you can make a four or five landings at the other airport to get the student into the habit of verifying the gear is down and green.  On this leg you can demonstrate how the constant speed prop works with the manifold pressure and RPM.
     
    Depending on how the first leg went I may move onto the second scenario.  In this scenario I will begin to introduce failures of the complex systems.  For example, what happens if the prop hub goes out.  What are the expected symptoms of such an event.  It will get the student into the emergency checklist and will allow you to evaluate his system knowledge.  For example, you can have a weather system that requires a diversion to a nearby airport, as the student deploys the gear it “magically” fails (either by a verbal command or other method up to your discretion).  The student is now faced with getting down before the thunderstorm tears the airplane up and making a safe landing.  This has the added benefit that you can evaulate his SRM/CRM and judgment skills and it makes it much more interesting for the student.  It is quite possible to see the student decide to land gear up or forget to extend the gear via the emergency gear extension.  That would be an interesting debrief item.
     
    Scenario three may deal with secondary systems that are required to be operational for the complex systems to work properly.  For example, if we lost oil pressure what can we expect with the propeller hub and ideas to minimize damage to the propeller.  If the electrical system is needed for the gear to extend possibly failing the electrical system.  What happens when one of the three landing lights fail to illuminate?
     
    Spattered throughout the scenarios are the numerous landings to drill in that the gear must be down green and locked.  The ability to get behind the faster moving aircraft and learning to think faster to stay up with the airplane and any new avionics that the student hasn’t played with before.  I think it is important that you are not only giving a complex endorsement but also an aircraft checkout in the process so I would teach everything that entails to ensure the student knows how to operate all the equipment on board.
     
    The last thing that I would integrate into the 10hrs of training is hazardous attitudes.  The student may think that he can outrun a storm or do things he may not want to do in a 160HP cherokee.  I hope this helps you figure out what to do.  Just a side note, scenarios like these require ample time for a prebrief and debrief to ensure the scenario runs smoothly and the lessons learned are validated at the end of the flight.

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  2. Steve Pomroy on Feb 09, 2011

    Hi there LovemyGF.
     
    +1 to Wesley’s post.  Some good pointers there.  Now for my $0.02 worth.
     
    I’m not in the American system (Canadian), so I can’t really advise with regard to FAA regulatory requirements.  But from a general “what do I actually need to know to (safely) fly a complex single” standpoint, I would suggest you keep the following in mind:
     
        1) GENERAL:  It will take some time for your student to get used to the higher speeds of the new aircraft.  Planning airport departures and arrivals will (initially) be a bit of a task due to the improved climb rates and higher airspeeds.  Also, anticipating the new, wider turn radius (for example, on the turn from base to final) will initially casue some minor troubles.  These are all easy fixes and just require your student to gain some exposure to the faster operating pace required.
     
        2) CONSTANT SPEED PROP: Take some time in flight to demonstrate (and have your student practice) prop manipulation.  Look at the effects of RPM changes without throttle movement (MP will change, A/S may also change).  Then look at the effects of throttle changes without prop changes (RPM stays constant, A/S changes).  Then try a few power setting combinations as per teh flight manual power chart.  Do this in the training area in cruise flight with nothing else going on so your student can really focus on the engine management.  This will make terminal procedures much easier whan you get to them.
     
        3) RETRACTABLE GEAR:  Take some time in the training area in cruise flight to learn to use the gear as well.  Drill the procedures “check speed — gear down — wait — confirm three green” and “check speed — gear up — wait — confirm lights out“.  Note the speed (or climb/descent rate) change with gear down versus gear up.  Doing these drills initially away from the busy-ness of an actual approach will make life much easier when you do start landings for real.
     
        4) OTHER SYSTEMS:  Do similar drills with any other systems the aircraft has.  For example, the fuel system in the Arrow, I believe, is of the one-tank-at-a-time variety.  So drill the tank change, “fuel pump on — switch tanks — confirm pressure/flow — fuel pump off — confirm pressure/flow“.
     
        5) SPEED LIMITS:  If your student isn’t already in the habit, airspeeds and/or airspeed limits should be called prior to configuration changes.  In principle, this really shouldn’t be anything new.  But in my experience, it often is.
     
        6) SYSTEMATIC CHECKS:  The post-takeoff check is often overlooked in simple singles, but is very important in complex aircraft.  Confirming the operation of the prop governor (as you set climb power) and the retraction of the gear are of particular importance.  You should fit in a T’s and P’s check as well, along with any system checks necessary (e.g. – “fuel pump off — pressure holding“).  The final check (distinct from the pre-landing check) is also an important one that is often overlooked in simple aircraft.  A simple, “props set — flaps set — three green” at some pre-determined altitude or runway distance can save some expensive embarassment, or worse.  It basically serves as a redundant check against the “that could kill me if I miss it” pre-landing check items.
     
        7) SYSTEM FAILURES:  Clearly, once your student is proficient with managing the systems under normal ops, you’ll want to start working through failures.  If possible you should actually work through the (non-simulated when possible and safe) failures in flight.  But be careful for some possible gothchas that could lead to real emergencies.  I haven’t flown the Arrow, so I can’t comment on specifics.  I’ll leave that to your best judgement.
     
        8) MANEUVERS:  Of course, it’s a new aircraft for a fairly low-time pilot, so review of some basics like slow flight, stalls, and steep turns would be advisable.  But these are not items I’d expect to spend a lot of time on.  Once the inititial area work is done, expect to spend some (maybe a lot of) time in the circuit.  This is where you can really work most of the above advice.  Also, crosswind landings are a common weak item, and are especially important in a retractable gear aircraft.  So I would recommend some work on these.
     
        9) KEEP IT FUN:  Don’t get so caught up in the details that you forget to have some fun.  For example, if you find youi’re spending a lot of time in the circuit (you very well might be), go to another airport for a change of scenery.  That’ll help keep things interesting.  And the departure-cruise-arrival experience will help your student place their training into the context of a real (read “non-training”) flight.
     
    Cheers,
    Steve
    http://www.flightwriter.com

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  3. James MacGregor CFI on Feb 09, 2011

     Well the FAA has a AC on what they recommend
     
    Advisory Circular 91-B Pilot Transition Courses for Complex Single Engine and Light, Twin-Engine Airplanes
     
    Make sure you cover a few areas:
    Things happen ALLOT faster in a clean (gear up) high power aircraft, this guy should fly the pattern with purpuse and percision, before he even touches a complex.
     
     The sink rate in landing is higher, learn how to soften the touch down with power and use energy management in a power out landing
     
     Pull the breaker and have him do a REAL emergincy gear extension
     
     Teach him to feather the prop back in the decent while carring some MP to increase GS and decrease shock cooling
     
     Pull the prop back in the climb, cant tell you how many people have that thing redlined all the way to cruse altitude.
     
    Stalls, aclerated and cross controled, MCA etc.

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  4. MaggotCFII on Feb 10, 2011

    Just adding to the above which all are terrific.  I’m printing this question for the “that’s a great idea” file!
    Weight and Balance – do fly with the airplane near max GW and the CG near the aft limit.  This one is a mandatory for me no matter what the airplane.  Of course use the POH for real numbers!
    Night – preferably a no moon night, various takeoffs/landings, various configurations and do some no landing light landings.  Yes, all landings to a full stop.  Additionally, practice a night X/C departure, perhaps just out to a VOR then to another airport.
    Required time – the 10 hours of time required for the insurance is a minimum.  Your guy has to know this going into the process.
    If his private CFI is available do have a chat with him.
    Create a “Training Plan” which you brief, share and follow. Modify along the way if need be.
    Since you are new to the CFI world, now is the time to begin setting both your reputation and standards.
    Make the experience a learning event for yourself!

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  5. John D. Collins on Feb 10, 2011

    I agree with most of the comments above, but offer the following for consideration.
     
    This is a time when we as instructors teach what we were taught and propagate a lot of OWT (Old Wives Tales). Among them include over square operation is bad, climb power reduction, and shock cooling. Leaning technique is different with a complex airplane than it is with a fixed prop aircraft.
     
    I remember when I was checked out in the Arrow 200, we used full power until we were off the runway and then the MP was reduced to 25 inches and the RPM to 2500 RPM, we were constantly increasing the MP as we climbed until we were back at full throttle.  Now, I would recommend full power climb to altitude, it is easier on the engine, although if you wish, you can reduce RPM if noise is a factor, as the engine is rated for continuous operation at 2700 RPM and full throttle. In fact, don/t expect to get near the service ceiling of the airplane if you restrict the RPM.
     
    With a pressure engine, an EGT is normally used for leaning and technique for finding peak EGT and establishing a suitable mixture should be taught.  If the fuel injected engine will run smoothly when lean of peak, you might consider teaching this if you are up on current engine management thinking.  John Deakin’s Pelican Perch on Avweb can be used as an excellent resource for this topic.  If you do some research, you will find the worst place to operate the engine is at 50 degrees F rich of peak.
     
    Obviously, emergencies should be taught.  In my old Arrow 200, it had the automatic gear system, and if you lost the engine, you had to override the gear extension system to prevent the lowering of the gear. Also, it is important if you have this system, to understand the effect of density altitude on automatic gear extension.  In some cases, you have to override the system to get the gear to come up.  I leased my Arrow to a flight school in California, and they did not do a full checkout of a pilot in this regard.  The result was that the pilot got caught in a down draft in the Tahoe area and tried to climb out of it, the gear came down, he didn’t know how to override the system, and he eventually crash landed in the Truckee river. The airplane was a total loss, but fortunately no one was hurt.
     
    The effect of the position of the prop control on a power off glide should be demonstrated.  It should result in a measurable improvement in the glide distance. On my Bonanza, with its larger engine, the difference is dramatic and a real eye opener, 1400 FPM with the prop forward verses 800 FPM with it at the full rear stop.  The arrow with its smaller engine an slower glide speed won’t have as much of an effect, but I would at least check it out.
     
    If the airplane has an autopilot, you should teach the basic operation  and how to override it if it is necessary.  The same is true if it has any non standard avionics, such as a GPS.  The pilot should at least be taught the basics.
     
    It is also important to stress that the airplane is a cross country machine and that it can get further away from home in a shorter time.  This means weather planning is more important since greater distances may mean he will fly into different weather than the local weather.  It is probably a good time to suggest the advantages of the IFR rating.
     

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  6. LovemyGF on Feb 10, 2011

    Wow, thanks for all the responses! 
    One question I must ask though, and I saw it based on two answers.  The RPM and manifold settings after takeoff.  I have been taught by one instructor to square it off at 25, and then add 1″ manifold pressure per 1000′ as we ascended, while another didn’t care that I keep full forward on the prop (2700) and full throttle up to altitude.  Which is correct?
    Also, our Arrow has had the automatic gear extension system disconnected, and I think there may even be an AD for its removal.

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  7. John D. Collins on Feb 10, 2011

    Your first description is what I learned back in the 1970’s.  Since that time, more has been learned (actually relearned) about engine management, particularly after the introduction of engine monitors.  I can’t say that a particular technique is correct or incorrect, but I subscribe to the KISS method and have adjusted my flying to match new information.  I now use the everything forward method. Of course, there is a caveat, that you should follow the aircraft POH as there are some engine combinations that limit maximum RPM and full power to a specific time limit. 
     
    Why did I switch? What originally got me to thinking about the subject, was after I had an engine analyzer installed in my Bonanza.  One of the first things I noticed, was that pulling the throttle back caused the EGT and CHT temperatures to increase.  That is the result of the mechanical linkage on the throttle that controls fuel flow on a fuel injected engine.  It is designed to make the mixture extra rich at full throttle.  Have you ever noticed that when you pull the throttle back, it takes a lot of movement before the MP starts to drop.  This is because you are in effect leaning the engine and power doesn’t fall off much as you lean from the very rich mixture used for full throttle operation.  The leaner mixture causes the higher temperatures and is not as good for the engine.
     
    Second, the engine is rated for continuous operation at full throttle and RPM.  In fact, most performance charts assume this for climb performance, so if those cases, don’t assume you will get the book performance with a lower power setting. The same is true at higher altitudes, to reach the service ceiling you need full throttle, with the mixture leaned appropriately for best power, and maximum RPM.
     
    Third, it is more work. If you are climbing from sea level, the MP will start out just under 29 inches, and by the time you reach 4,000 feet (actually closer to 3000 feet) the MP will have come down to 25 inches or lower.  So instead of making 3 or more  power changes and diverting your attention inside the aircraft, all for a few early minutes of the climb, the KISS method, push it forward for takeoff, set your power when you level off.  When you make those power reductions, initially you are close to the ground and altitude is your friend.  With lower power your climb rate will suffer in a greater ratio than the power reduction % because it is excess power above that required for flight at a given speed that is proportional to the climb rate.  So assume you need 50% power to maintain altitude, that means you have 50% power available for climb at full power.  Reduce the power by 10%, now you have 90% power, of which only 40% is available for climb, or a 20% reduction in your climb rate.  Being an engineer by education, I have gone thru the calculation and determined that the engine will turn fewer revolutions climbing with maximum power over the flight because you get to altitude sooner and to the higher cruise speed sooner.
     
    There are some trade-offs in leaving the throttle at full, while just bringing the RPM back to 2500 or 2600 in the climb.  The lower RPM will reduce the climb rate, but may make your departure quieter for you and the neighbors.  I personally have found that the sooner I get higher, the better.
     
    So, in conclusion, I climb full throttle and maximum RPM because it is simpler, gets me to a safe altitude sooner, matches my POH performance charts, is easier on the engine, and gets me further down the road.
     

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  8. James MacGregor CFI on Feb 10, 2011

    Is easier on the engine?

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  9. John D. Collins on Feb 10, 2011

    James,
     
    It is easier on the engine because of the richer mixture and the higher RPM. Both have the effect of reducing the peak internal cylinder pressures or moving the peak to a point in the cycle where greater mechanical advantage is achieved.  CHT is an indirect indicator of lower maximum ICP. A lower CHT is better for the engine.
     
    I would suggest reading the following articles written by John Deakin at http://www.avweb.com/news/pelican/182544-1.html 
     
    He now teaches a course on engine management that is state of the art.  See the Plane & Pilot article on the course at http://www.planeandpilotmag.com/aircraft/maintenance/an-advanced-course-in-engine-management.html 
     
    They also offer an on line course with the same content.
     

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  10. Wesley Beard on Feb 10, 2011

    John is absolutely correct!  Running any engine away from peak EGT is a good way to prolong the life fo the engine.  The drawback is that most GA aircraft are not equipped to stay away from peak EGT (either rich of peak [ROP] or lean of peak [LOP]) without knowing our exact fuel flow.  Obviously to make the performance charts, the manufacturers needed to have a way they could duplicate fuel flows and decided on the method used today; either peak EGT + some value or lean till engine roughness and increase just a tad.
     
    It’s my opinion that running LOP is quite safe with the proper equipment and instrumentation on board to closely monitor the engine.  Without such fine equipment, LOP operations can be detrimental to the engine.  However, as John pointed out running at or near peak EGT is also dangerous to the engine. 
     
    Some interesting articles about GAMI injectors and running LOP.  The graphs showing the danger area are quite interesting and validate John’s posts.  As a side note, running LOP creates no carbon monoxide so there is not chance of getting CO poisoning.
     
    http://www.gami.com/articles/bttfpart1.php
    http://www.gami.com/articles/bttfpart2.php
    http://www.gami.com/articles/bttfpart3.php
    http://www.njsflight.com/images/Piston_Engine_Operations.ppt
    http://www.eaa42.org/misc/gregs_show.ppt
     

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  11. James MacGregor CFI on Feb 11, 2011

    Well if its not your airplane the yea climb at 100% nothing flies like a rental lol

    However if you are one that feels a pinch in their wallet at abbreviations like TBO I might not be cramming the throttle. Also if your students are going to be flying for a living, pax like a quiet cabin, not hearing a prob scream away just below redline.

    As for the old wives tales of shock cooling…

    The problem is you have a jug made out of two different materials. An aluminum head that is screwed and shrunk onto a steel barrel (all barrels are steel regardless of whether they are nitrided, chrome, ceramic, or other on the inside). Aluminum has a higher thermal conductivity than steel and a higher coefficient of expansion. So, putting the coals to the engine on takeoff, the head expands at a greater rate than barrel, no big deal because the head is on the outside.

    The aluminum piston in the steel choke bore doesn’t matter either because the clearances are so ridiculously loose. But because the clearances are loose you can get piston slap if the engine it too cool when you apply takeoff power (a ROT I use is two minutes and 200F CHT before going above 1000 RPM).

    Now lets take the power off. Now the aluminum cools and shinks at a faster rate than the barrel. The heads are also generally where most of the cooling surface area is (largest fins) and aren’t heated by another source (there is still friction and oil splash on most of the barrel, plus residual heat from the crankcase that will prevent it from cooling as fast). The head barrel interface can then become too tight. Since the head is a casting of a complex shape, it can be very prone to cracking.

    I like to teach my students to fly the company aircraft the same way I like my personal aircraft to be flown. Regardless of the POH, full throttle climbs for long durations and abrupt changes in settings are not the type of finesse I expect of my students. Just my 2 cents

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  12. Steve Pomroy on Feb 11, 2011

    James, posted 6 days ago elsewhere:
     
    http://www.avcanada.ca/forums2/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=71232&p=672661#p672661
     
    Perhaps you should credit your sources.  Or perhaps I’m out of line and you fly for pie?
     
    Steve

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  13. John D. Collins on Feb 11, 2011

    James,
     
    That is the way I fly my airplane where I have a strong interest in its longevity and want to keep fuel and maintenance costs to a minimum.  Pulling the throttle back during the climb is not helpful for the engine nor does it reduce fuel consumption in a measurable way. A better argument can be made for reducing the RPM to reduce noise, and is why I will do so as appropriate. I have owned and operated a flight school in the late 90’s and we had good performance from all of our engines. 
     
    As I stated earlier, a lot more is known about engine management than what I was taught in the 1970’s, but many instructors aren’t trained in current thinking on the subject.
     
    I would be happy to have a separate discussion on the subject of why I believe that shock cooling is an OWT, but it would probably be appropriate to do so as its own question or blog.
     

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  14. James MacGregor CFI on Feb 11, 2011

    Steve, good stuff on av eh?

    I usually check this forum at while I have down time, so my replys are written on my iPhone, tried to do one of those fancy quote indents didn’t work out on my little screen!

    Anyway credi to avcanada.ca for that last paragraph and a website worthy of a bookmark as well.

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