High-performance endorsement / CFI medical

7 Answers

1. 
   

   
   

   Jim F. on Nov 07, 2013

   If your CFI gave you 115 hrs of HP instruction and no endorsement, then you need to find a new CFI regardless of medical status…

   +6 Votes 7 Votes  1 Votes

2. 
   

   
   

   Beata Profenia on Nov 07, 2013

   I would prefer a response based on the regulations rather than a value judgment. Thanks.

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3. 
   

   
   

   Wes Beard on Nov 07, 2013

   I agree with Jim.

   The endorsement is required for the legal pilot in command. You can’t be the legal pilot in command because you don’t have the endorsement. The CFI can’t be the legal pilot in command because he doesn’t have a medical.

   If you were to have a third pilot with the endorsement and valid medical who is also willing to be the legal pilot in command then the CFI can give you the training but who in their right mind would want to do that for GA pilot training in small airplanes?

   +2 Votes 2 Votes  0 Votes

4. 
   

   
   

   Bob Watson on Nov 07, 2013

   Something isn’t adding up….
   The OP has an ASEL so he’s solo’d and taken a check ride.
   The OP states that 115 of his/her 135 hours is in a High Performance (> 200HP) C-182
   So, the bulk of the OP’s solo time and checkride must have been in some non HP airplane.

   I’m left wondering:
   Did the CFI instruct the OP on how to fly a HP airplane (i.e. the C-182 they are flying)? If so, why no sign off? At the same time, if the CFI did do some HP-related instruction in the 115 hrs of dual (and logged it as such), then the endorsement would seem like the easy part. If, the CFI never mentioned HP instruction in the OP’s log book, the CFI (and the OP) might be stuck.

   However, even if the latter situation is the case, all you’d have to do is wait for the CFI to get a new medical or go up and get the HP sign-off from another instructor.

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5. 
   

   
   

   Mark Kolber on Nov 07, 2013

   Brett, If your do not currently have your HP endorsement, the CFI who gives you the training for it will need to be acting as PIC*; thus he needs a current medical under 61.

   (*strange but possible combinations like three pilots on board with someone else acting as PIC excepted)

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6. 
   

   
   

   Jim F. on Nov 07, 2013

   All I’m saying is that you should be worried as to why your CFI didn’t give you the HP endorsement on like, hour 2 or 3 of the 115 hours of dual…

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7. 
   

   
   

   John D Collins on Nov 11, 2013

   I had an interesting discussion with a DPE who’s opinion I value. He claimed that if the student pilot was endorsed for solo flight in the C182, that this would satisfy the requirement for a high performance endorsement. Here is his rational:

   61.31(f) states:

   (f) Additional training required for operating high-performance airplanes.

   (1) Except as provided in paragraph (f)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a high-performance airplane (an airplane with an engine of more than 200 horsepower), unless the person has–

   (i) Received and logged ground and flight training from an authorized instructor in a high-performance airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of a high-performance airplane, and has been found proficient in the operation and systems of the airplane; and

   (ii) Received a one-time endorsement in the pilot’s logbook from an authorized instructor who certifies the person is proficient to operate a high-performance airplane.

   Although instructors are provided guidance in AC 61-65e for the form of an acceptable endorsement, this is not regulatory.

   In most cases, the training and endorsement needed for a high performance occur after one obtains their private pilot certificate. However, it is not specified that this must be the case in 61.31(f). Further, in order for a student pilot to solo a single engine aircraft, including a C182, they must comply with 61.87 which details the training required prior to solo in any aircraft. This training includes all the elements of the 61.31(f) requirements including an endorsement. I have included the relevant sections that would apply to a C182.

   Sec. 61.87 Solo requirements for student pilots.

   (a) General. A student pilot may not operate an aircraft in solo flight unless that student has met the requirements of this section. The term “solo flight” as used in this subpart means that flight time during which a student pilot is the sole occupant of the aircraft or that flight time during which the student performs the duties of a pilot in command of a gas balloon or an airship requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember.

   …………………………..

   (b) Aeronautical knowledge. A student pilot must demonstrate satisfactory aeronautical knowledge on a knowledge test that meets the requirements of this paragraph:

   (1) The test must address the student pilot’s knowledge of–

   (i) Applicable sections of parts 61 and 91 of this chapter;

   (ii) Airspace rules and procedures for the airport where the solo flight will be performed; and

   (iii) Flight characteristics and operational limitations for the make and model of aircraft to be flown.

   (2) The student’s authorized instructor must–

   (i) Administer the test; and

   (ii) At the conclusion of the test, review all incorrect answers with the student before authorizing that student to conduct a solo flight.

   ……………………………..

   (c) Pre-solo flight training. Prior to conducting a solo flight, a student pilot must have:

   (1) Received and logged flight training for the maneuvers and procedures of this section that are appropriate to the make and model of aircraft to be flown; and

   (2) Demonstrated satisfactory proficiency and safety, as judged by an authorized instructor, on the maneuvers and procedures required by this section in the make and model of aircraft or similar make and model of aircraft to be flown.

   ………………………

   (d) Maneuvers and procedures for pre-solo flight training in a single-engine airplane. A student pilot who is receiving training for a single-engine airplane rating or privileges must receive and log flight training for the following maneuvers and procedures:

   (1) Proper flight preparation procedures, including preflight planning and preparation, powerplant operation, and aircraft systems;

   (2) Taxiing or surface operations, including runups;

   (3) Takeoffs and landings, including normal and crosswind;

   (4) Straight and level flight, and turns in both directions;

   (5) Climbs and climbing turns;

   (6) Airport traffic patterns, including entry and departure procedures;

   (7) Collision avoidance, windshear avoidance, and wake turbulence avoidance;

   (8) Descents, with and without turns, using high and low drag configurations;

   (9) Flight at various airspeeds from cruise to slow flight;

   (10) Stall entries from various flight attitudes and power combinations with recovery initiated at the first indication of a stall, and recovery from a full stall;

   (11) Emergency procedures and equipment malfunctions;

   (12) Ground reference maneuvers;

   (13) Approaches to a landing area with simulated engine malfunctions;

   (14) Slips to a landing; and

   (15) Go-arounds.

   ……………………………

   (n) Limitations on student pilots operating an aircraft in solo flight. A student pilot may not operate an aircraft in solo flight unless that student pilot has received:

   (1) An endorsement from an authorized instructor on his or her student pilot certificate for the specific make and model aircraft to be flown; and

   (2) An endorsement in the student’s logbook for the specific make and model aircraft to be flown by an authorized instructor, who gave the training within the 90 days preceding the date of the flight.

   ………………………

   (p) Limitations on flight instructors authorizing solo flight. No instructor may authorize a student pilot to perform a solo flight unless that instructor has–

   (1) Given that student pilot training in the make and model of aircraft or a similar make and model of aircraft in which the solo flight is to be flown;

   (2) Determined the student pilot is proficient in the maneuvers and procedures prescribed in this section;

   (3) Determined the student pilot is proficient in the make and model of aircraft to be flown;

   (4) Ensured that the student pilot’s certificate has been endorsed by an instructor authorized to provide flight training for the specific make and model aircraft to be flown; and

   (5) Endorsed the student pilot’s logbook for the specific make and model aircraft to be flown, and that endorsement remains current for solo flight privileges, provided an authorized instructor updates the student’s logbook every 90 days thereafter.

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