Welcome Guest. Sign in or Signup

7 Answers

91.213 question: VFR Day type certificate?

Asked by: 14643 views ,
FAA Regulations

91.213(d)(2)(i)  is the basis of my question. It lists what equipment can be inop and still legal to fly (assuming you placard and deactivate/remove it). But this particular part confuses me:

(i) Part of the VFR-day type certification instruments and equipment prescribed in the applicable airworthiness regulations under which the aircraft was type certificated;

Can someone point me towards an example of this? More specifically, maybe give me an example of an aircraft that conforms to items 2-4 but not to item #1? 

Thanks

Ace Any FAA Written Test!
Actual FAA Questions / Free Lifetime Updates
The best explanations in the business
Fast, efficient study.
Pass Your Checkride With Confidence!
FAA Practical Test prep that reflects actual checkrides.
Any checkride: Airplane, Helicopter, Glider, etc.
Written and maintained by actual pilot examiners and master CFIs.
The World's Most Trusted eLogbook
Be Organized, Current, Professional, and Safe.
Highly customizable - for student pilots through pros.
Free Transition Service for users of other eLogs.
Our sincere thanks to pilots such as yourself who support AskACFI while helping themselves by using the awesome PC, Mac, iPhone/iPad, and Android aviation apps of our sponsors.

7 Answers



  1. Kris Kortokrax on May 11, 2015

    Seats is an example.

    Looking at the POH for a 172RG, the pilot’s seat is required equipment. The other seats are standard equipment, but not required.

    Seats are not required by 91.205

    Seats are not required by an Airworthiness Directive.

    There is a requirement in 23.785 that there be a seat for each occupant.

    +2 Votes Thumb up 2 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes



  2. Mark Kolber on May 11, 2015

    Probably the aircraft you are flying.

    An aircraft that has ADs will conform with 4 and not 1.
    An aircraft that was type certificated without anticolision lights but adds them will need to comply with 3 and not 1.
    An aircraft that is legal for night flight or IFR flight is going to conform with 2 and 3 but not necessarily 1.

    0 Votes Thumb up 0 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes



  3. jon sanderson on May 16, 2015

    Not sure if my last response made it through, sorry if this is a duplicate.

    Kris, I believe your example applies to 91.213(d)(2)(ii), not 91.213(d)(2)(i).

    Mark, as I understand it, you have listed examples of 91.213(d)(2)(ii-iv), but not 91.213(d)(2)(i).

    (i) refers to the VFR Day type certificate

    “Part of the VFR-day type certification instruments and equipment prescribed in the applicable airworthiness regulations under which the aircraft was type certificated”

    0 Votes Thumb up 0 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes

  4. Best Answer


    Kris Kortokrax on May 17, 2015

    No, the example I gave refers to 91.213(d)(2)(i).
    Assuming 2 people are going flying,

    (ii) no seat other than the pilot’s seat is required by the equipment list,
    (iii) no seats are required by 91.205 and
    (iv) no seats are required by an Airworthiness Directive.

    23.785 (an airworthiness regulation under which the aircraft was type certificated) requires that there be a seat for each occupant. This is the reference in 91.213(d)(2) that requires the seat to be available and operative (not broken).

    +1 Votes Thumb up 1 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes



  5. Mark Kolber on May 19, 2015

    jon, even as to (d)(2)(i), it’s still probably the airplane you are flying. (d)(2)(i) refers to minimum certification requirements for day-VFR flight as of the date the airplane received its original type certificate.

    If you are asking whether an airplane that conforms with all the other sections will also conform with (d)(2)(i), it probably will since all the others either include or go beyond those requirements.

    If you are asking whether conformity with (d)(2)(i) means conformity will all the others, the answer is usually no since all the others can go well beyond day VFR minimum certification requirements. If your airplane may be flown at night, you are already outside of (d)(2(i) requirements.

    0 Votes Thumb up 0 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes



  6. jon sanderson on May 22, 2015

    Ahh, Ok. Kris and Mark, I think I’m better understanding you now. Kris, when you referenced the seats I initially thought you were simply referring to the POH’s required equipment list, but now that I understand the POH only requires the one seat for the pilot, and other rules apply for carrying passengers, it makes more sense. Those ‘extra’ rules would be the airworthiness regs at the time of aircraft certification, e.g., 91.213(d)(2)(i)…

    So now the question becomes: where do I go to find lists of airworthiness regs for various aircraft that were certified in different years/decades?

    Again, thanks to both of you for your help in this question, I’ve been trying to get to the bottom of this for a while.

    0 Votes Thumb up 0 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes



  7. Mark Kolber on May 23, 2015

    So now the question becomes: where do I go to find lists of airworthiness regs for various aircraft that were certified in different years/decades?

    Good luck with that one. You might be able to find a reliable reference that includes all the prior iterations of the applicable Part of the FAR and the prior CAR.

    The good news is related to your question. Practically speaking, for most aircraft we fly, there is unlikely to be something applicable the in original certifying regs that is not already covered in at least one of the other categories.

    0 Votes Thumb up 0 Votes Thumb down 0 Votes


The following terms have been auto-detected the question above and any answers or discussion provided. Click on a term to see its definition from the Dauntless Aviation JargonBuster Glossary.

Answer Question

Our sincere thanks to all who contribute constructively to this forum in answering flight training questions. If you are a flight instructor or represent a flight school / FBO offering flight instruction, you are welcome to include links to your site and related contact information as it pertains to offering local flight instruction in a specific geographic area. Additionally, direct links to FAA and related official government sources of information are welcome. However we thank you for your understanding that links to other sites or text that may be construed as explicit or implicit advertising of other business, sites, or goods/services are not permitted even if such links nominally are relevant to the question asked.